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Corrections to K S B Keats-Rohan's, "Domesday Descendants"
"Married Mabel or Matilda, daughter of William II Mauduit (cf. Rot. De Dom. 38-39), by whom he had issue Haimo, Basilia, Amice." Haimo and Mabel also had four other children – Ala, wife of William de Echingham; William (d.s.p.1248), successor of Haimo his brother; Alan (d. 1248) who briefly succeeded William his elder brother leaving a son and heir John fitz Alan (d.1274); and a daughter who was a nun at Delapre Abbey. Elvey (1975), p. xlii Rosie Bevan - 22 Nov 2003 p.935 Filius Patricii Comitis, Patricius He married Ela widow of William de Warenne III whose date of death is given as 1147. The date of William’s death is correctly given as 1148 on p.240 under Comes de Warenne, Willelm III. Eldon Olson - 01 Nov 2004 http://users.ox.ac.uk/~prosop/domesday-descendants-corrigenda.pdf Katharine Keats-Rohan "He died in 1159 leaving two daughters and coheiresses, Amabel wife of William Neville and Matilda, wife first of Adam de Montbegon, and then of Gerard de Glanville." Matilda, daughter of Adam fitz Swain was married three times. By Adam de Montbegon who died before 1172, she had issue Roger de Montbegon d.s.p. 1227. Her second husband was John Malherbe of Appleby, Lincs. d.1181, by whom she had three children - John Malherbe d.s.p. bef 1216; Mabel, wife of William de Lemare; and Clemence, wife of Eudes de Longviliers. Maud married thirdly Gerard de Glanvill but had no issue by him. A succession of charters to the monastery of Monk Bretton, which Adam fitz Swein founded, indicates that her eventual heirs were by her second husband John Malherbe - her grandchildren, Mabel de Lemare, wife of Geoffrey de Nevill, and John de Longviliers. Adrian Channing, Rosie Bevan - 20 Jul 2003 http://users.ox.ac.uk/~prosop/domesday-descendants-corrigenda.pdf Katharine Keats-Rohan "Son of Bertram I Haget and brother of Bertram II, both of whom he had succeeded by c.1165/71. Married Alice, daughter of William of Friston, by whom he had issue Geoffrey (d.v.p.), Ralph, abbot of Fountains (1170-90), Agnes wife of Alan fitz Brien of Bedale, Gundreda, Alice, wife of Jordan de St. Mary, Lucy, wife of Peter fitz Toret." A discussion of gifts by Gundreda Haget and others to Fountains abbey, ends with the statement (re: Add. MS. 18276, f. 228d) that, 'At an earlier date Matthew de Brame had released to Geoffrey Haget all claim to the inheritance of Geoffrey Haget, uncle of the said Geoffrey.' [EYC, 1: 403, no. 520] This infers a relationship between the two Geoffrey Hagets as uncle and nephew. Confirmation of this is found in a charter for Gundreda Haget's gift to Sinningthwaite of the advowson of the church of Bilton, Yorks., in which she refers to Bertram Haget as her father. It is therefore clear that Gundreda Haget and her siblings were children of Bertram II Haget, not of his brother Geoffrey. Dugdale, 1817-30, 5: 464, Num. III (Sinningthwaite); EYC, 1: 403, no. 520 John Ravilious, Rosie Bevan - 12 Dec 2004 "Brother of Hugh Malebisse, a Yorkshire tenant of the honour of Mowbray. By his wife Emma, a natural daughter of William de Percy, he had issue Richard, Geoffrey, William, Hugh and Amice, wife of Stephen of Blagby. He died in 1176". This version of the Malebisse family is at odds with the pedigree by Farrer of the Malebisse family given in EYC, 3: 456, which is confirmed by details from Byland abbey charters:
EYC, 3: 456; Burton (editor, 2004) Rosie Bevan - 05 Aug 2005 Dugdale, Monasticon Anglicanum, IV, p. 14, no. VI - should be vol. V Chris Phillips - 01 Dec 2002 p.1027 Maminot, Walchelin; Maminot, Walchelin II "…he left issue his successor a son Walchelin II (d.c.1190) and a daughter and eventual heiress Alice, wife of Geoffrey I de Say (d. 1214)". "…his heir was his aunt Alice, sister of Walchelin I and wife of Geoffrey I de Say (d. 1214)". The wife of Geoffrey de Say I was actually Alice de Chesney, whose parentage was established by Round, from comments in Dugdale's Baronage, based on the cartulary of Coxford (Norfolk). These showed that Alice, the wife of Geoffrey de Say, and Emma, the wife of Michael Belet, were daughters and coheirs of John de Chesney. Evidently, the Says' interest in the Maminot lands came through this John de Chesney. John was the son of Ralph de Chesney and the grandson of another Ralph, a Domesday tenant. The cartulary of Merton Priory records that Hugh Maminot [the grandfather of Walkelin] gave the manor of Petham (Kent) to Ralph de Chesney in marriage with his daughter Alice. Chronologically, this would be John's father rather than his grandfather. So Geoffrey de Say succeeded Walkelin Maminot as a result of his marriage to the granddaughter of Walkelin's aunt. Dugdale, Monasticon, IV, pp. 95-97 - should be vol. V Round, 1902, p.9, citing Dugdale, 1817-30, 1: 511, 614; HKF, 3: 316, prints an extract from Dugdale's notes from the cartulary (Bodleian, Dugdale MS 39, f. 103.); Salzman, 1924, pp.21-22, citing Cotton MS Cleopatra C VI, no 69. Salzman points out that, according to a manuscript from Lewes Priory, Ralph was predeceased by a wife named Emma (Dugdale, 1817-30, 5: 14); DD, p.369 says that Ralph's wife was Emma Maminot, apparently assuming that these wives were identical and that the Merton cartulary is mistaken about the name. Mardi Carter; Chris Phillips - 01 Dec 2002 p.1058 Paganel, Willelm II; p.325 de Bidun, Halenald II "…Sarah, Agnes’ daughter by her first husband Halenald II de Bidun." Halenald is stated to be Agnes’ first husband, when in fact, as correctly stated on p.325, he was her second. Chris Philips - 10 Jun 2003 "…born 4 March 1133...". All other sources give that Henry was born on 5 March 1133. Stuart Baldwin: The Henry Project: http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/prov/henry002.htm Eldon Olson - 01 Nov 2004 "Son of Walter IIII Tirel of Poix…" This is a typographical error and should read "Son of Walter III Tirel of Poix…" Gordon Kirkemo - 11 Dec 2003 "[He left issue] two daughters Eleanor, wife of Alexander fitz Richard, and Matilda, son of Fulk fitz Richard." Presumably the latter is meant to be "Matilda, wife of Fulk fitz Richard". Henry Sutliff III - 24 Mar 2003 |
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